ACKERMAN: No, not at all. Just a clarification, David, the Personal Ordinariate is not in the form of the Apostolic Constitution, but rather is provided for as a general normative structure for those Anglican faithful who desire to enter into the full communion of the Roman Catholic Church in a corporate manner. This is another pastoral response of the Roman Church to the request of certain Anglicans that has been evolving for many years due to the requests from bishops, priests, deacons and the laity of the Anglican Communion. Pope John Paul II instituted what is called the "Pastoral provision", and placed it under the jurisdiction of the Sacred Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith. Since 1980 the "Pastoral Provision" has provided a means for Anglican Clergy, married or celibate, seeking to come into the full communion of the Roman Catholic Church, to be considered for Ordination in the Roman Catholic Church, retaining elements of the Anglican Liturgical tradition. As a person who has been aware of these conversations ecumenically, this evolution is not surprising.

VOL: The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith has erected this Personal Ordinariate within the territory of England and Wales for those groups of Anglican clergy and faithful who have expressed their desire to enter into full visible communion with the Roman Catholic Church. The Decree of Erection specifies that the Ordinariate will be known as the Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham and will be placed under the patronage of Blessed John Henry Newman. Isn't this the answer to the prayers of ALL Anglo-Catholics around the world that they are now welcome into the bosom of Rome? Is this something you could now accept? If not, why not?

ACKERMAN: The Personal Ordinariate is governed according to the norms of universal code of canon law and the present Apostolic Constitution and while it is subject to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, there are also other Dicasteries of the Roman Curia who are engaged in governance in accordance with their competencies. It is important to note that it is also governed by the Complementary Norms as well as any other specific Norms given for each Ordinariate, such as might be the case for England and Wales. Entrance into full communion with Rome through an Ordinariate involves a personal decision, and a sacramental process. So one would be hard pressed to say that it is an answer to prayer for ALL Anglicans.

This decision for unity involves acceptance of the pastoral care and the authority Christ entrusted to the successors of St. Peter. Such a personal assent of faith needs to be formed and informed. Moreover "non Anglo-Catholics" often make the mistake of thinking that there is uniformity among Anglo-Catholics. Anglo-Catholics in England are not necessarily unified in their desire to go to Rome. For some it is a matter of timing. The Press Release on January 24 by the Society of St. Hilda and St. Hugh is an obvious indication of the lack of unanimity. Signed by twelve Anglo Catholic Bishops of the Church of England, they say, first in reference to those who have entered the Roman Catholic Church from the Church of England, "We wish them Godspeed as, heeding the call of conscience, they embark on a new episode in their Christian discipleship.

We, too, in similar obedience to conscience, seek, if at all possible, to remain faithful members of the Church of England and undertake to support all who seek to do likewise." They also say, "Even at this late hour we are seeking a way forward that would enable us with integrity to retain membership in the Church of England."

In the American Church a significant number of Anglo-Catholics do not use the 1979 Book of Common Prayer, nor any contemporary forms in Liturgy. In the UK it is not uncommon to see the current Rites of the Roman Catholic Church (Latin Rite) as normative, including prayers for Pope Benedict. This is a bit less common in the United States and Canada. If I were pressed I would identify Anglo Catholic groupings as: Anglo-Papal, Anglo-Orthodox, High Church, Continuum, and Affirming Catholic. To the casual observer they may well appear to be similar, but their ultimate goals vary. Some see reunion with Rome as the only obvious way to move forward. Some see union with Constantinople as an ultimate goal. Some believe that being in Communion with an historic See is secondary to maintaining an "orthodox theology with orthodox liturgy."

Some believe that the externals are what is essential, and some believe that whatever their particular Province "affirms" is what is essential. Self described "Anglo-Catholics" exist in the Episcopal Church, the ACNA, the Continuum, and in "Ordinariate in formation" groups. On February 7, the largest group within the Continuum, articulated by chancellors of the Anglican Church in America, indicated that they are not united in their response to the Ordinariate. "According to our canons, those Bishops, clergy and parishes who leave for another jurisdiction, such as a Roman Catholic Ordinariate of the so-called Patrimony of the Primate, have, at this time abandoned the communion of this church and the ACA." Even as I respond to your question I recognize that there will be 150 people with 150 different points of view regarding these reports and my description of the various groupings who will be responding with their own definitions and insights.

The point is - it is rather difficult to characterize an Anglo-Catholic. The vast majority may well agree that an Anglo-Catholic is one who believes in the reality of the continuation of a pre-1540's Church in England and as with a number of the principles of the Oxford Movement. Moreover, the vast majority of Anglo Catholics in the Americas have always believed and taught that they are Catholics but not Roman Catholics. Gathering all Anglo Catholics together is often an opportunity to see a variety of divisions.

VOL: In time the Pope will offer a Personal Ordinariate in the US and Canada. What will you do then?

ACKERMAN: I believe at this time I am called to continue as a bishop in the Anglican Communion and to encourage orthodox Anglicans who are, self described "Anglo Catholics," in the worldwide Anglican Communion. As a Bishop committed to the ARCIC dialogues, when one considers Anglicanorum Coetibus, it seems to me that the Ordinariates in some measure make provision for the organic and visible unity that Archbishop Michael Ramsey pledged that Anglicans would work and pray for. As this was also the prayer of Christ it shall be my prayer for the church in the East and the West. To this end I will continue to work closely with the Churches of the East and the West. The Eastern Orthodox have offered measures not unlike the Ordinariate, and the number of Western Rite Eastern Orthodox parishes in the Americas continues to grow by leaps and bounds. Moreover the Society of St. Alban and St. Sergius has been revived in the Americas and is still a substantial voice in the United Kingdom.

VOL: A Personal Ordinariate is a canonical structure that provides for corporate reunion in such a way that allows former Anglicans to enter full communion with the Roman Catholic Church while preserving elements of their distinctive Anglican patrimony. With this structure, the Apostolic Constitution Anglicanorum coetibus seeks to balance, on the one hand, the concern to preserve the worthy Anglican liturgical, spiritual and pastoral traditions and, on the other hand, the concern that these groups and their clergy will be fully integrated into the Roman Catholic Church. Why would this not satisfy you and other Anglo-Catholic bishops like Jack Iker, William Wantland or John-David Schofield?

ACKERMAN: Obviously I cannot speak to what the discernment of each Anglican rooted in Tractarian Principles should consider, in the wake of the generous act of the Holy See in response to cries for help from Anglicans who have been theologically marginalized. As the days ahead unfold, Anglicans who discern a call to full union with the See of Peter will learn to live into their new identity as catholic Christians under the Code of Canon Law as well as the internal norms and statutes which will regulate the sacramental, pastoral and administrative life of the Ordinariate. The required administrative structures are already set out in the Complementary Norms that accompany the Constitution. As you point out, David, Anglicanorum Coetibus authorizes the Ordinariates to use books that carry the Anglican liturgical heritage: "so as to maintain the liturgical, spiritual and pastoral traditions of the Anglican Communion within the Catholic Church as a precious gift nourishing the faith of the members of the Ordinariate and as a treasure to be shared." Note those last words. What the distinctive "Anglican rite" liturgy of the Ordinariate will be is yet to be worked out. When that project is completed it will need the recognition of the Holy See as well as the discernment of Anglicans now in Communion with the See of Canterbury.

VOL: Wouldn't Anglo-Catholics be closer in heart and spirit to Rome than to a Protestant Anglican group like the Anglican Church of North America (ACNA)?

ACKERMAN: In the present crisis in the Anglican Communion, a crisis of faith and a crisis in leadership, we know full well that many Evangelical Anglicans are also following their consciences and making decisions under the Word of God in Scripture in view of this crisis. There are, in fact, some "independent Anglican" churches that are not in Communion with any group. The division that many people suggest regarding the expression of catholic and "more protestant" expression is not due to a different understanding of the Word of God but may be due to the manner we include Tradition alongside Scripture as the way we frame the faith once delivered to the saints. I think all sides, honor fidelity to the Sacred Scriptures, as well as being faithful to the great dogmas of the Incarnation, Redemption and Resurrection. It is clear that in this struggle all sides have agreed about the Gospel truth and how they shape and inform the ethical life as revealed in Jesus Christ. In fact, I am aware that there are some Evangelicals who are being sources of encouragement to Anglo Catholics considering the Ordinariate, both in the UK and in the Americas. I can well imagine that some self described "Evangelicals" would note that there are different expressions within that broad term just as I have suggested there are within the Anglo Catholic tradition. To the casual non Evangelical observer there does not seem to be much difference between a Low Churchman and an Evangelical. This, however, would not be a well informed observation. Ironically the description of the ACNA as "a Protestant Anglican group" would undoubtedly be the description of an observer. That would probably not be how the ACNA would describe itself.

VOL: Anglo-Catholics remain, dare I say, bitterly opposed to Women's Ordination which is now recognized in the Church of England at least to the level of the priesthood. The new line in the sand, it seems, is the real possibility of women bishops in the C of E. If that is a bridge too far in the UK for Anglo-Catholics, why has that not been the case in the US and TEC which has had women bishops for more than 20 years?

ACKERMAN: David, as you know the decision by the General Synod came after nearly 12 hours of debate on a compromise proposed by Archbishop Rowan Williams of Canterbury and Archbishop John Sentamu of York and was narrowly defeated. The situation is such that now the diocesan synods have now been asked to scrutinize a scheme where women bishops would have the authority to make alternative arrangements for objectors through a statutory code of practice.

The Anglo-Catholic group of the synod had wanted episcopal visitors, or "flying bishops," to minister to their members instead, but their requests were rejected. The issue in all these cases is that these decisions which are monumental and reshape the faith are not done in a conciliar way. When one speaks of changing fundamental dimensions to the expression of the catholic faith, has not such decision always been done through the ministry of a Council of the Church. Conventions and Legislative Synods are not Councils of the Church. For traditional Anglo Catholics the ordination of women is an innovation that was not determined in a true conciliar fashion. Anglo Catholics are not so much "bitterly opposed to Women's Ordination" as they are committed to an unbroken heritage of Faith. Anglo Catholics, by and large, do not believe in an "Anglican" or "Roman Catholic" priesthood, but rather in the Catholic priesthood, and believe that they have not been given the authority to change that which has been revealed. This principle is, to a large extent, what conditions other challenges to the "faith once delivered to the saints." It is a matter of conciliar revelation versus local innovation.

VOL: The Episcopal Church's innovations over women's ordination seems not to have been the tipping issue. A number of sexuality resolutions passed by successive general conventions tipped the scales contributed to the formation of ACNA. Why was this more of an issue than WO which has dominated the Church of England scene?

ACKERMAN: Since the 1990s, the archbishops and bishops in the Anglican Communion have met globally and locally to discuss the issue of human sexuality and the proposed revision to historical norms and teaching on that topic. I think the strong voice and influence of the African bishops on this topic has influenced the headlines in this country. The involvement of the Global South in the UK has not been as significant as it has been here in the USA and Canada. Nonetheless, we are thankful for Godly men like Archbishops Kolini, Orombi, Nzimbi and Akinola. Sadly that resulted in North America with an attack on the African leaders, accusing them of having adopted a "very superstitious" form of Christianity. The real question is: Is it superstitious to, in good conscience, affirm the Biblical teaching about human sexuality? The Anglo Catholic "party" in North America has been a minority group that has been marginalized by the Episcopal Church for decades. Anglo Catholics themselves have been divided in the Americas. Sadly, our geography has had a negative impact on our gatherings. Often, for example, in England, one need only take the Tube (subway) to attend a meeting. In the Americas we have to take an airplane. Again, sadly, there are some pragmatic realities in our ability to function as a unified body. In addition, traditionalists have often spent a great deal of time discovering new ways of dividing instead of uniting. As a lifelong Anglo Catholic I can say, with a finger pointing at myself, that we all too often have traded in the Foot Washing Ceremony for the foot shooting and hand wringing ceremonies.

VOL: You have been personally badly treated by TEC's hierarchy which has included loss of some benefits, why would the Pope's offer, which could easily translate into full time parish work as a priest, not be a way forward for you?

ACKERMAN: The vocation to the episcopate is a calling or a life, not simply one occupation in the church. This means that the bishop like the priest has been called by God and given the gift of God, that is, the grace to accomplish his work. "That thou stir up the gift of God which is in thee by the putting on of my hands . . . [God] has saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace" (II Timothy 1:6,9). The calling is holy, high (Philippians 3:14), heavenly (Hebrews 3:1), and therefore, the response to this calling and the acceptance of it and the ways of carrying it will have its challenges, pains and privileges. The bishop must give account for all those committed to his charge and that is not something that I take lightly and binds me to discern choices beyond my own personal circumstances. That being said, all Christians shall give account of themselves to God and they must be especially careful not to put a stumbling block or an occasion to fall in their brother's way (Romans 14:12-13). If this is said of all of Christ's followers, how much more does it apply to bishops, priests and deacons, whose responsibility is to lead the faithful to their salvation? When the people are exhorted to obey them that have the rule and submit themselves, it is because those rulers "watch for their souls, as they that must give account" (Hebrews 13:17). Given the vows I have taken and the call of Scripture I continue on the vocation I have been given as a bishop. My entire life has been a life of discernment, and I will serve where it is obvious that God wants me to be. I will do so without judging what others believe they are called to do.

VOL: Does it strike you as odd that the Roman Catholic Church which is known to move at the speed of an Edsel in low gear did, within the space of a week, take five Church of England bishops, laicize them, and then made them deacons and then priests in short order?

ACKERMAN: At Oscott College, the Holy Father said to the (Roman) Catholic Bishops of England and Wales that the "Ordinariate helps us to set our sights on the ultimate goal of all ecumenical activity: the restoration of full ecclesial communion in the context of which the mutual exchange of gifts from our respective spiritual patrimonies serves as an enrichment to us all.' I believe the Holy Father feels a very strong call to the urgency of Christian Unity and that for those who desired to accept this invitation to show the possibilities of the Ordinariate, he acted with alacrity.

As you know Pope Benedict has appointed the Reverend Keith Newton as the first Ordinary of this Personal Ordinariate. Together with Frs. Burnham and Broadhurst, they will oversee the catechetical preparation of the first groups of Anglicans in England and Wales who will be received into the Roman Catholic Church together with their priests at Easter, and will accompany the clergy preparing for re-ordination to the priesthood around Pentecost.

Given the nature of the identity of this group of Anglicans this was a pastoral response to the needs of this group of the faithful. Of course it should be noted that these Godly men were not laicized, they resigned as bishops in the Church of England, made the profession of faith and were received into the fullness of communion with the See of Peter.

VOL: None of those bishops who fled to Rome can be made bishops (if they are married). Is that in any way a deterrent to you that you would lose your bishop status if you chose to go to Rome?

ACKERMAN: As I understand, those who are appointed to serve as Ordinaries in the Ordinariate, are entitled to full pontificals, even though they may not be ordained to the episcopate. If one reads Article 11 of the complementary norms it says that "§4. A former Anglican Bishop ... who has not been ordained as a bishop in the Catholic Church, may request permission from the Holy See to use the insignia of the episcopal office." Notice it says "episcopal" and not just "prelatial. In fact if one consults the "Ceremonial of Bishops," it states that: "Prelates who are equal in law to a diocesan bishop but have not been raised to the episcopate may wear the same vesture as bishops." Moreover canonically they serve with ordinary delegated authority in terms of the administration of the Ordinariate. This is more than "all dressed up and no place to go."

VOL: There seems to be very little interest in the Pope's offer in the U.S., just the odd parish here and there, but no bishops and no real excitement. Does that surprise you?

ACKERMAN: I think given the profile of the bishops in the UK it can seem that way but Cardinal Donald Wuerl has now been named the Vatican's Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith's delegate and head of an American ad hoc committee charged with helping to implement the apostolic constitution in the United States and to help bring about the American ordinariate. He is assisted by Bishop Kevin Vann, Bishop of Fort Worth (Roman Catholic) who is well known to many Anglicans and the Rev. Scott Hurd, a pastoral provision Roman Catholic priest (former Anglican) who is also a liaison to the United States Catholic Conference of Bishops for the emerging Ordinariate. In short I think that there is a great deal of interest. I think that it is noteworthy that more than just a few bishops who formerly served in the Episcopal Church are now serving as priests in the Roman Catholic Church. It seems that at this point the Ordinariate is really in its infancy in the United States given the fact that there are at least 20 identifiable, Protestant, Episcopal, Traditional Anglican Communion, Missionary Episcopal, and Anglican Use congregations, societies and religious orders, incorporating thousands of individuals, who are seeking membership in the Anglican Ordinariate in the United States. So now the challenge before them is to become one Catholic spiritual family in the Anglican Ordinariate and I am sure that these men given charge for oversight will find a path for that to happen.

VOL: If the women's ordination issues are not resolved somewhere down the line, will you stay in ACNA?

ACKERMAN: I believe that at the moment only 6 of the 28 ACNA jurisdictions currently allow women priests. This reflects well the situation in orthodox Anglicanism on this question as Rwanda, Kenya, Uganda, and Ghana make provision for women priests, while Nigeria, Tanzania, and Central Africa do not. So this is an orthodox communion question not simply an ACNA question. I tend to view history in terms of the long view rather than the short view. I am not so important that I have a right to see how all matters are resolved. I am, however, "important" enough, like all Christians, to be used by God, how, where, and when He wishes. As I have indicated I will not judge those who have remained in the Episcopal Church nor will I judge those who have left. I care about peoples' opinions, but on Judgment Day that is all that their words will be - opinions. It is God's Judgment that matters to me. VOL:

VOL:Thank you bishop.