Sexual Healing is Goal of Mastering Life Ministries
VOL Interviews David Kyle Foster
By David W. Virtue
www.virtueonline.org
September 2, 2009
The figures don't lie.
Out of every 16 people sitting in the front row of your church, there are two struggling with some degree of sexual identity confusion. Four are victims of childhood sexual abuse while four more struggle with some form of sexually immoral and addictive behaviors including pornography, compulsive masturbation, homosexual attractions, adultery, voyeurism or some other sinful bondages.
It is not only true of people in the front row of your church, but in every single row of every church in America. What this means is that approximately 60% of everyone in your church is struggling with some form of sexual sin and/or brokenness issues.
These are the conclusions drawn by Dr. David Kyle Foster, 58, a former male prostitute, a man once addicted to bondage and to pornography. Though a pastor's son, pornography took hold of him at the age of nine. From heterosexual promiscuity he moved to homosexual attractions becoming a male prostitute. He even rented his home to pornographic film companies. Because of his intensifying addictions, he sought death.
"I secretly lead a lifestyle as a prostitute for seven years hoping someone would kill me. On several occasions, people did try to kill me, but God stepped in to stop it each time. It was all about money, sex, power and fame...the most powerful strongholds under Satan's dominion with no way out."
Foster's TV & film acting included two starring roles, two featured roles, and seven national commercials under the stage name "David Kyle". http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0477371/ He appeared once on The Dr. Phil Show. http://drphil.com/shows/show/601/
Unhappy with his lifestyle, Foster decided he would make a trip to Israel to see if he could be forgiven and overcome the sexual stronghold engulfing his life.
"In July 1980 I began praying in the Garden of Gethsemane. It was there on my knees that I forsook my past life."
During the next nine years he found continuing deliverance and transformation. He attended Trinity Evangelical Divinity School (TEDS), a seminary in northern Chicago to discern whatever call God might have on his life as a man redeemed.
In 1989 God told David to begin a ministry to sexually bound people. "This was revealed to me in a small church in Chicago where I gave testimony of the deliverance I had experienced from the bondage to sexual sin. These people accepted me with many admitting their own sexual bondages."
An idea was born in David's mind which he believed was the work of the Holy Spirit.
"I began to give seminars on how people could be set free." He wrote his first book "Sexual Healing" which got read from people in the White House to the Big House as well as officials in Prison Fellowship, Youth with a Mission (YWAM) and Exodus International - a ministry to sexually addicted people, mainly homosexuals." The foreword to "Sexual Healing" was written by psychiatrist Dr. John White of Vancouver, (now deceased) who encouraged David in his writing and ministry. Evangelist and sociologist Tony Campolo used it in ministering to President Bill Clinton following his sexual scandal. The book is also a recommended resource of Prison Fellowship, Youth with a Mission (YWAM), Exodus International and other ministries.
Foster says his ministry has never been mainly to homosexuals rather it covers all sexual sin issues. "One of my goals has been to teach the body of Christ that the cause for most every major area of sexual sin is fundamentally the same (with only a few minor variations) and that the cure for them all is also essentially the same, which is developing intimacy with God and receiving His power and direction to change."
Soon David found people knocking on his door looking for seminars. They included seminaries like Asbury, Trinity Episcopal School for Ministry and many others. One notable Anglican, Dr. J.I. Packer joined his advisory board. "We've always been more of a 'teaching' ministry than a 'counseling' one, so we have never developed the raft of support groups that other ministries often do."
David began a radio program, "Mastering Life", which helped grow a new aspect to his ministry - support fellowships for those who have friends or family members who are struggling with homosexual confusion. He also also started groups for men struggling with pornography.
"Since some pastors can be judgmental and untrained in sexual matters, and since most people will never consult their pastor about such issues, David has focused on training all the 'best friends' what to do when their friend confesses a sexual struggle to them."
David's primary message is that people find their identity in Christ, nothing and no one else. "The real expert of experts is Jesus Christ, the Supreme Counselor is the Holy Spirit and the One to put the missing pieces back is the Father himself."
David said that in 2005 God turned his world upside down. "God opened a door to our mission through TV. We started 'Pure Passion,' a broadcast program sent out on ten TV networks spanning the globe. We are now being heard not only in North America and Europe, but in Russia, Romania and Bulgaria and we began using top professionals like Fr. Francis McNutt."
Within days of opening his ministry to the world, testimonies started pouring in of changed lives. One was notable lesbian activist Charlene Cothran who was set free from her former lifestyle by the power of Jesus Christ.
David believes people can be free from sexual sin and brokenness including transexuality. "There is hope, healing and deliverance if people want it," says David. "I know I am one such person. One can be delivered from same sex attractions and online pornography. It is what Mastering Life Ministries is all about."
Today his life's work is helping hundreds of thousands of men and women break free from the bondage of pornography, same sex attractions and any number of sexual addictions through Mastering Life Ministries - a television based ministry that is the largest of its kind in the world today.
VIRTUEONLINE spoke with Dr. Foster and he agreed to answer some questions about sexuality and his ministry.
[b]VOL: Pansexuality is becoming almost universally accepted in mainline Protestant denominations including The Episcopal Church, the United Church of Christ and now the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America. Within a few short years it will be officially accepted by all mainline denominations except the Southern Baptist Convention, independent evangelical churches as well as the Roman Catholic Church. Aren't you tilting at windmills to believe you can stop the flow of history here? [/b]
FOSTER: I have no illusions that anything that I do can stop the flow of history. Christ never commanded us to stop the flow of history. He commanded us to be salt and light in the world, to bear witness to the truth, with love and compassion. What the angels and archangels are able to do with our obedience in that regard is beyond my knowing, but I do know that if only one person is rescued from this darkness as a result of the Holy Spirit working through our witness, that is a prize that will rebound for all eternity.
[b]VOL: Gay activists talk much about orientation, assuming a gay gene will one day be found. Even assuming a proclivity or propensity towards homosexuality (without a gene) can we ask people to say no to what drives them? [/b]
FOSTER: The Bible overflows with admonitions to say "No" to each and every sinful temptation, orientation and behavior that falls short of the glory of God. That is part of the cross that Jesus told us we must bear (Mt 10:38; 16:24) if we are to be His disciples. I must say "No" to greed, to lying, to adultery, etc (1 Cor 6:9-10). Jesus even set the sexual standards higher than before when He declared that lusting after someone in the heart was a breech of God's moral law (Mt 5:28). Grace was never meant to lower the moral law, but rather to perfect and empower it.
Although science has thoroughly proven that there is no gay gene, it wouldn't matter if there was. The moral standard remains the same. How is that fair? Because, for every temptation that we suffer, God makes a way of escape (1 Cor 10:13) and by the Holy Spirit, the power to resist (Gal 5:16; 2 Pet 1:3-10). And what is more, when we fall into sin even still, God provides the blood of His own Son to pay the penalty for that failure (1 Jn 1:9).
The substance that fuels this entire plan is God's compelling love for us (Rom 5:8; 2 Cor 5:14) expressed through grace, which the Bible says teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness (Titus 2:11-14).
[b]VOL: The biblical evidence does not support any sexual activity outside of heterosexual marriage. Is that position still viable in the 21st Century where people talk of committed monogamous same-sex relationships? [/b]
FOSTER: In that regard, the fundamental question is "Does moral law pass away - ever?" And the answer is that it cannot because it is rooted in the very being of God Himself. Until God's character changes, moral law cannot change. The immutability of God prevents that from ever happening. To base moral law on the sinful whims and inclinations of a fallen culture is ludicrous.
Many are tripped up by claims that Jesus fulfilled the law of Moses. Indeed He did fulfill the ceremonial/ritual law because He became the embodied fulfillment of all that it pointed to. But He did not fulfill the moral law because it is of a different kind altogether. Jesus became the supreme example of it, not to get rid of it, but rather to display the glory of God that permanently resides within it.
One other observation concerning your question: statistically, "committed monogamous same-sex relationships" don't exist. Sure, there are handfuls here and there, mostly because of the fear of AIDS, but statistically they don't even show up. Studies have shown that supposedly committed gay couples have multiple sex partners every year and that after 5 years, monogamy cannot be found in any but that statistically invisible handful.
The reason for this is that homosexual behavior is rooted in a subconscious drive to repair emotional deficit and damage, yet their subconsciously chosen solution for the problem never actually fixes anything, which explains the astronomical rates of promiscuity, disease, substance abuse, suicide, domestic violence and death found in the gay community.
During my ten years in the gay lifestyle, I would periodically test out couples who claimed to be monogamous (some who had supposedly lived that way for decades), by attempting to seduce one of the partners. Not once did my attempt fail. People in the gay lifestyle know full well that claims of faithful monogamy are a sham. They exist only to trick well-meaning straight people into championing their cause.
[b]VOL: Since you have gone "both ways" as it were, have you since married? [/b]
FOSTER: After graduating from seminary, and experiencing a good seven years of significant and deep healing, I felt healed enough to marry and that became the single greatest question for my life. I waited and waited on God for quite some time for specific direction on the matter, because I was willing to devote my life to Christ in the manner the Apostle Paul wrote about in 1 Cor. 7:32-35 if that was what God wanted, though on the other hand I'd had deep longings to marry that stemmed back into childhood. Finally, after almost demanding an answer one night, the Lord gave me a dream in which I was attending a wedding ceremony in heaven. Suddenly, and to my surprise, I discovered that I was the one getting married, and then to even further surprise, it was made known to me that I was marrying God. This was astonishing to me. The concept had never even crossed my mind and I had no knowledge of such experiences by others.
Some months later I was flipping through a catalog and saw a ring that had my name inscribed on it in Hebrew within the verse from Song of Songs that says, "I am my beloved's and He is mine." (SS 6:3) As I looked at the ring, the Lord said to me, "Buy it. That's our wedding ring." Realizing that God was indeed calling me to marry Him alone, I said to God: "But no one will believe that you have healed me from homosexuality", to which He replied, "Don't worry, I'll take care of that." After that, earthly marriage has been completely off my radar scope.
[b]VOL: The Episcopal Church talks big about inclusivity as a way to bring LGBT persons into its midst and to grow the church. That doesn't seem to be happening. Why do you think that is the case? [/b]
FOSTER: Homosexuals are not flocking to churches that try to excuse their sinful relationships because deep down inside they know very well that they are committing sinful acts, and no one wants to be a hypocrite, except those who profit from the ruse.
Romans 1:18ff makes it very clear that those who commit homosexual acts know that what they are doing is in rebellion against the created order. Even the design of male and female bodies makes that obvious. Romans also tells us that for those who persist in rebellion, God sends a delusion so that they lose conscious awareness of their sin. This is a part of God's judgment - Yes - but it is redemptive in nature, so that they will eventually see the emptiness and folly of their choice, repent and return to Him to be saved.
The gay activist takeover of major denominations has little to do with misguided love for God. It has to do with a chronically insecure community that is trying to coerce acceptance, respect and political power by donning the garb of legitimacy. By the very nature of their brokenness, homosexuals suffer from arrested emotional development. They are trapped in a preadolescent emotional state due to trauma or neglect. Their charade of "Let's dress up like holy people and pretend we are holy and maybe that will make us holy" is a deeply disturbing manifestation of the "magical thinking" that pervades their thought processes. I know. I've been there and done that. And it took many years of healing and the grace of God's revelation before I was finally able see the labyrinth of deception that I had been under.
Those who support the cause of gay activism are actually contributing to their deepening deception and will answer to God for it. Even if the entire world becomes fooled by the charade, God is not fooled and He will not be mocked.
[b]VOL: You talked about the church's "maintenance program" What were you referring to? [/b]
Foster: By and large, secular psychology operates with an a priori bias against God. If you look at the life and writings of many of its kingpins (Freud, Jung, etc) this bias is sometimes subtle and at other times shockingly overt.
The Bible indicates that men, who through their own wisdom reject God, become fools (1 Cor. 1:18-25). The history of psychology is replete with examples of that very thing. So we have to be very careful about reliance on the supposed wisdom that comes to us from those in rebellion against God and weigh it very carefully against divine revelation. That which today is seen to be the epitome of psychological brilliance, tomorrow is likely to be thrown on the ash heap.
Because God has been left out of the equation, secular psychology is left with the strength and wisdom of man to solve its problems. Without divine revelation, it can only create "maintenance programs" for people's ills rather than offering the interior, "transformation program" that God wants to impart. People are taught steps, methods and models for "maintaining their sobriety" rather than receiving an inner transformation of the heart and mind.
In response to the modernist movement of the 19th and first half of the 20th century, many evangelicals unconsciously adopted the presuppositions of rationalism in order to appear reasonable and logical and thereby win the minds of men. Like the secular world, we downplayed, if not outright rejected, the ongoing supernatural actions of God in people's lives and our absolute dependence on Him. (Alistair McGrath writes brilliantly of this in his book, A Passion for Truth).
Sadly, many in the world of Christian psychology have unwittingly done the same. The newest discoveries in the science of human behavior are fascinating and alluring and before we've realized what has happened, we've placed our reliance and our hope for healing on those discoveries and the methods and models created from them rather than on God. The newest method is much easier to prescribe than the messy and unpredictable business of leading people into an intimate relationship with God.
I can remember sitting in psychology classes at seminary some 30 years ago, and seeing this take place before my very eyes. In class, we would be regaled with the latest psychological discoveries and admittedly it was fascinating stuff. But when I went back to my room to continue working on my own healing process, I sought and received from the Father everything that I needed for life and godliness (2 Pet 1:3). No one in class was even suggesting the pursuit of intimacy with God that I was experiencing and where I received levels of inner transformation that no man-made method or model could ever produce.
The contrast enabled me to see the hidden danger and the unwitting shift of alliances that can occur in the course of being trained in the wisdom of man. No believer ever intends for that to happen, but because of their rationalistic presuppositions and the allure of knowledge, it just happens. Fortunately there are those in Christian psychology who have seen the same danger, who valiantly sound the alarm and who suggest a balance between the two and a prioritizing that is healthy (Dr. Larry Crabb and Dr. Sandra Wilson come immediately to mind).
[b]VOL: Some homosexuals, for example, feel that it is abuse to want to change people from one sexuality to another? Would you agree? [/b]
FOSTER: I disagree foremost with the presupposition behind their contention. There are not two competing or contrasting sexualities involved in this matter. There is only one sexuality - the one God created in the beginning - heterosexuality (Gen 2:18-24). It is the only sexuality that Jesus reaffirmed (Mt 19:4-6). It is stamped into our very physiology. Homosexual confusion, on the other hand, is an emotional disorder - a brokenness - and the fruit of rebellion - that can be reversed (1 Cor. 6:11).
A second presupposition in their statement is that we are trying to change people. No one who understands the issue tries to change anyone. It has to be an act of God in a similar way that deliverance from addiction cannot permanently occur without supernatural assistance from God.
Helping people find the healing and transformation that is needed to be free from homosexual lust is just as much an act of love as is trying to help an alcoholic or a sex addict find freedom from their broken condition.
[b]VOL: You were ordained a priest in the Charismatic Episcopal Church in 1995 and appointed a "Canon" in 1997, serving at the Cathedral in Jacksonville, Florida. In 2005, you returned to the Nashville, TN area and in 2008 transferred your ordination to Grace Chapel (Calvary Chapel) near your home. What made you leave the CEC for a non-denominational church? [/b]
FOSTER: I have tried to follow the voice of the Holy Spirit in every major decision of my life as a believer. Some years ago, I wrote an article (A Tour of Christendom) about my journey through the body of Christ that will provide a much more detailed picture of my ecclesiastical movements in life and the reasons behind them. http://www.masteringlife.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=49:a-tour-of-christendom&catid=36:comparative-religion&Itemid=29
This latest change was a big surprise. I am at the age now where settling into one place for the duration is the most comfortable choice to make. But when the Lord brought me back to Nashville (where there is no CEC church) in 2005 to produce our TV program, I was left to pick a church or plant one and having no time to plant one, I started attending Grace Chapel (www.gracechapel.net) and absolutely fell in love with it. After a couple of years, it just seemed like the obvious thing to do.
[b]VOL: You asked the question is your church equipped to meet that crisis? In your opinion are most ministers willing to reach out to sexually addicted persons or are they too afraid of their own sexuality? [/b]
FOSTER: Most pastors receive absolutely no training in Bible school or seminary in how to minister to sexually broken people. Being in a leadership position, where they are expected to know how to fix everything, it is often easiest to avoid the topic altogether.
Another factor is the high number of pastors (over 50%) who personally struggle with bondage to sexual sin of one kind or another. Because of their failure to find freedom for themselves, they often feel hypocritical or grossly ill-equipped to help others. Such men or women also fear exposure of their own sin and the loss of career that might result. Some fear exposure because they don't want to give it up. And so they will not bring in a leader who specializes in this area because they are afraid that the specialist will somehow sense and then expose their sin.
Other leaders don't deal with the subject because they are in a church or denomination that has historically considered such ministry out of bounds. Bringing in teaching and ministry in this area might make good donors so uncomfortable that they leave and they don't want to rock that boat. Besides, others in the church (or in leadership in the denomination) may suspect that the leader has a problem with sexual sin if he is bringing in someone who specializes in that area. It's the classic "fear of man" syndrome.
Still other pastors will not address sexual sin issues in their church because they are afraid that if they talk about it, THEY will come. In other words, if their church becomes known as a church that will minister to the homosexual or sex addict, that might persuade such people to start attending their church in search of help. And bottom line - they don't want those kind of people in their church. Very sad. Fact is, those kind of people are already in their church, secretly dying from shame, and wondering why God isn't helping them.
What such pastors forget is that God will hold them accountable for hiding their sin, for not offering the grace of God to any and all who repent, and/or for not properly shepherding their flock. They need to put all fear aside, trust God and address the elephant in the room.
[b]VOL: You mentioned in passing, transsexuals. What is your experience with transsexual persons? What is your experience in dealing with such persons who have had sex reassignment surgery? [/b]
FOSTER: The simplest way to discern cases is to go with the chromosomes. They will tell you what God's intent for their gender has been in spite of all other factors. If there is a "Y" chromosome, God created a boy.
Having said that, there needs to be a great deal of extra grace extended to those who suffer from this confusion because of the hormonal forces that often drive them counter to their genetic makeup. While it must be said that we go with the presence or absence of a "Y" chromosome as our guide to gender selection rather than the person's interior feelings, we should always take into consideration the extra burden that this condition brings to certain lives and take a long-term gentle approach to making the right choices and seeking God for healing.
As for sex reassignment surgery, it should not be done. Today, many such surgeries can even be reversed and many who have come to Christ has done just that.
We have two articles on this topic, which can be accessed by going to:
We've also done two TV programs on this topic with former transsexual Sy Rogers that people can watch by going to http://www.vimeo.com/album/67694. Sy was at the brink of sex reassignment surgery many years ago when Johns Hopkins University ended their reassignment program due to the many conflicts and complications that such surgeries brought into the lives of people.
[b]VOL: You say you want to equip saints worldwide and reach into the darkened homes of people using television as the medium because most people never get to a counselor. Aren't you in danger of making complex issues too simple and by doing so compound the pain that many are going through? [/b]
FOSTER: I am very careful about who I allow on the program for the very reasons you suggest. We allow only the very best experts on the show, or personal testimonies of those who have found significant transformation through Christ.
We have to be concerned with two fronts really: making the problem too complicated, or making it too simple. Both are counterproductive to transformation.
On the one hand, the field of psychology often invents very complicated fixes that ultimately get discarded after a long look has been taken at results. Many of those fixes have been very bad ideas (and in some cases have done a great deal of damage to people). Yet they proliferate and people are allowed to be used as guinea pigs until the long-term data comes in on results. In that regard, the field of psychology is akin to the early years of medicine, when a great deal of reckless experimentation was going on, and a lot of people were practicing who had no business even being in the field.
That's not to say that there aren't some highly skilled practitioners in the field today. There most certainly are. And there are also many Christian counselors who know how to keep the priority between God's wisdom and man's wisdom straight. But it is very difficult to do when the siren song of man's wisdom is continuously lapping at the door (as well as demanding that you bow down to it in order to get licensed).
It's interesting to note, for example, that in studies of success rates for psychotherapy, it has repeatedly been shown to fail most of the time. It fails so often, in fact, that it is more likely that you will get better by talking to a friend instead. In cases where psychotherapy succeeds, it's almost always the case that the therapist has effectively communicated unconditional acceptance to the client. So what is being effective then - the therapy or the communication of love, acceptance, affirmation and respect by another human being? Sometimes healing is far simpler than the experts want to believe.
I, for one, was about as sexually bound and broken as a person can possibly get and still remain alive. I was also hopelessly addicted to drugs and alcohol and was so out of control that I regularly walked into highly dangerous situations. Yet my healing process did not require psychotherapy, counseling or support groups - all mainstays of today's therapeutic culture. What I found was that healing comes primarily by entering into an intimate relationship with God the Father and listening to Him for information and direction. He may instruct you to see a counselor or He may not. He may use 12 steps for a while or He may not. One thing is for sure, He knows exactly what will work and in its perfect timing.
In the course of my healing process, God used Scripture, conferences and small fellowship groups and many divine appointments with good people in the body of Christ who just happened to be there to do or say just the right thing at the right time.
In that sense, healing is very simple - enter into an intimate relationship with God the Father (through Christ) and then just do what He says. He knows how to make something that is very complicated, seem doable, because He knows the proper timing and order of each issue that will need to be addressed, and He has the resources to bring the right people into the picture at just the right time. He also has the power to supernaturally impart things that are developmentally impossible at your present age - like the affirmation of a father that went missing when you were a little girl or boy.
The simplicity of my healing process didn't make things worse because it was grounded in reliance upon revelation, empowerment and direction God Himself rather than some simplistic formula, model or set of steps. In fact, I have found that the more complicated we make the healing process with all of our theories and models, the more of a burden we place on those trying to find freedom. They end up focusing on their problems and the steps they need to take to get free rather than the glory and revelation streaming from the face of God during intimate prayer and praise.
[b]VOL: Will a quick (or long) prayer necessarily cure or change deeply rooted sexual problems that might require a longer term remedy than you offer? [/b]
FOSTER: Instant changes are often expected by people suffering from arrested emotional development. They want what they want now, and they subconsciously put a stop watch on God and demand that He heal them in the time frame that they expect. When He doesn't, they use that as an excuse to rebel. This is classic preadolescent behavior that can be seen in sex addicts, homosexuals and others.
What then is the benefit of our once-per-week TV program? God has used our show to quicken people to action, to inspire, to give hope, to provide practical advice, and other similar benefits. We have never claimed to be the only necessary resource for a person's healing. We are only a voice in the wilderness pointing to the only One who is.
[b]VOL: Thank you Dr. Foster [/b]
You can see his ministry at the following addresses:
http://www.MasteringLife.org
and
http://www.purepassion.us
Additional links can be found here:
Touchstone Magazine - A Chautauqua Story; David Kyle Foster on the Intolerance of “Open” Communities
http://bit.ly/b0qJu
The Judas Church - by David Kyle Foster
http://bit.ly/3iTTQi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujPWcEPFUf8
An interview with the MacNutt's can be found here:
http://bit.ly/f5OkH
and here:
http://www.vimeo.com/3290237
Dr. Bill Maier (Focus on the Family), talks about gay marriage and witnessing to homosexuals:
http://www.cross.tv/15499
Dr. Michael Brown - Pts 1 & 2, who answers the toughest questions that gay activists can put to a believer
http://www.cross.tv/15275
http://www.cross.tv/15396
Dr. Robert Gagnon, who does a brilliant job at biblical apologetics on gay issues
http://www.cross.tv/14936
This is a link to the DVD video VOL obtained which tells MLM's story:
http://www.cross.tv/29421